It’s been almost two years to the day since Chris Ducker last joined us on the show to explain the concept of the Youpreneur. He’s been busy since then, running the branded Youpreneur community, and managing to write a brand new book on the subject.
It won’t take long into this episode to realize that Ducker and I are friends who tend to be a bit goofy when we catch up with each other. But don’t let the frivolity fool you — there are many important nuggets of wisdom in this conversation that are well worth the listen.
Beyond that, this chat highlights the insight that comes over time from serving a group of people, whether a blog audience, membership community, or real-world tribe. Paying attention and constantly evolving to serve your chosen people as best as possible is at the heart of modern entrepreneurism.
The Show Notes
- The Book: Rise of the Youpreneur
- Youpreneur Community
- Rate/review Unemployable at Apple Podcasts
Is the “Youpreneur” Approach the Right One for You? With Chris Ducker
Chris Ducker: Hey, this is Chris Ducker from Youpreneur.com, and I help people build, market and monetize their business around their personality and who they want to serve. And that makes me 100% unemployable.
Voiceover: Welcome to Unemployable, the show for people who can get a job, they’re just not inclined to take one — and that’s putting it gently. In addition to this podcast, thousands of freelancers and entrepreneurs get actionable advice and other valuable resources from the weekly Unemployable email newsletter. Join us by registering for our Free Profit Pillars Course, or choose to sign up for the newsletter only at no charge. Simply head over to Unemployable.com, and take your business and lifestyle to the next level. That’s Unemployable.com.
Brian Clark: It's been almost two years to the day since Chris Ducker last joined us on the show to explain the concept of the Youpreneur. He’s been busy since then, running the branded Youpreneur community, and managing to write a brand new book on the subject.
It won't take long into this episode to realize that Ducker and I are friends who tend to be a bit goofy when we catch up with one another. But don't let the frivolity fool you — there are many important nuggets of wisdom in this conversation that are well worth your time.
Beyond that, this chat highlights the insight that comes over time from serving a group of people, whether a blog audience, membership community, or a real world tribe. Paying attention and constantly evolving to serve your chosen people as best as possible is at the heart of modern entrepreneurism.
I'm Brian Clark and this is Unemployable. Chris Ducker, how are you, sir? It's been a minute.
Chris Ducker: It has been a minute. I feel good. How about yourself?
Brian Clark: I'm feeling great. I've gone from swilling Maker's Mark in a shallow tub with you, which sounds really worse than it was.
Chris Ducker: It was actually pretty good. I've got to be honest. That was a fun event.
Brian Clark: It was. It wasn’t a tub, it was a small outdoor pool. And your wife did walk in on us and she wasn't offended. So it was okay.
Chris Ducker: I believe she actually brought us additional ice at one point as well.
Brian Clark: That was amazing of her, because I expected her to go, “Clark, get out of my Cabana.”
Chris Ducker: Oh dude, the tangled web that we weave.
Brian Clark: Yes, indeed.
Chris Ducker: That was our time in the Philippines when you were here for Tropical Think Tank.
Brian Clark: That's right. And that was the second to last, if I recall correctly, Tropical Think Tank. It has been retired to austerity or…
Chris Ducker: Yes, yes.
Tell Us About Your Book
Brian Clark: But now, you have a new conference. I want to talk about that later, but we have this book thing that you went ahead and wrote.
Chris Ducker: Yeah, because I'm clearly a sucker for punishment.
Brian Clark: You are, because you told me, you swore after your first book, The Excellent Virtual…
Chris Ducker: It was so good, you forgot the title of it.
Brian Clark: It was good. I tell everyone to read that book and now I'm just blanking on the title. It was so…
Chris Ducker: Virtual Freedom, sir, Virtual Freedom.
Brian Clark: Yeah, of course it was freedom. What else would it be? Slavery? No, no. It would be freedom.
No jokes here people – Virtual Freedom. If you're beginning to build out the organization that we talk about on the show all the time, the company of one, the virtual network of people who assist you aided by technology and connection, that's the Bible. It's kind of like the practical 4-Hour Workweek, right?
I mean, Tim's book gave people the idea and I think Ducker's book really said, “Oh, here's how you do that.” That’s my opinion.
Chris Ducker: There’s a story behind that actually. That was the reason why I went with the publisher that I went with. So we actually shopped the book proposal. What happened was actually I got a book offer from a publisher in the US. I turned it down, because it was crap. And then I worked with an agent that put together a proper proposal. We shopped it to I think 16 different publishers and we got four offers on the book, which was incredible. I mean, we were so happy with it at the time.
But the reason why I went with the outfit that I went with, and it wasn't the largest advance, was because when I had a conversation with the publisher himself, the owner of the company, he said to me that he felt like this was the outsourcing section of The 4-Hour Workweek on steroids. Those were his exact words.
That just resonated with me so much, that he got it. He understood who the book was being written for and what it was going to do. And that was the reason why I signed with him and not somebody else. So there you go.
Brian Clark: It makes sense. I think that's a perfect description of the elaboration of an aspect of, obviously, a groundbreaking and really popular book by Tim. But yeah, it's more the “how-to” and when it comes down to it, you have, “That's a great idea” to “How do I do that?” And this shows all about how to do that.
I do want to talk to you about the new book, because you swore — I started to say that you weren't going to write another book. And then you did.
Chris Ducker: I think every author, when they're done writing and marketing their latest book, says, “I'm never going to write another book.” I'm sure they all do it, even if it's just to themselves. And then two or three years might go by and they get the itch. They get the author itch and they start thinking about it again.
I mean, yeah, I did say with Virtual Freedom that I wasn't going to write another book. But a lot has happened in my life and in my career since 2014 when that first book came out.
As you well know, as you've been privy to a lot of early discussions on Youpreneur as a community and as a brand, I believe at one point you said that you wish you had the domain name as well. I think that with the changes that have taken place over the last four years, it was inevitable that I was going to have to write another book.
Brian Clark: Yeah, well, Virtual Freedom was Chris Ducker at that moment and you've evolved in big ways, and I think Rise of the Youpreneur is where you're at
You told me this is what you want to do for the next decade of your life, at least, and that's a commitment. That's I think what I look for, because if you can't — even if you're wrong, even if someone comes along in three years and said, “Chris Ducker, we want this. Here's the check,” the commitment's what matters, not the actual duration that you're able to live with it.
The Importance of Focus and Commitment
Brian Clark: I don't see that all the time. I mean, let's go off on a tangent here and talk about wannabe entrepreneurs that don't really have what you would consider the amount of commitment. Can we touch on that for a second?
Chris Ducker: Yes, absolutely. And then they moan and complain when they don't achieve anything. You know what I mean? It’s shocking.
Brian Clark: There is a lot of whining and moaning. Yes.
Chris Ducker: It's no coincidence that if you don't have the focus and the commitment, it's not a coincidence that 9 times out of 10, you're going to end up not hitting the goals or just completely failing.
I'm a very, very goal-centered entrepreneur and I think a lot of that comes down to me kind of being indoctrinated and growing up in the sales and marketing arena. I mean, I left school when I was 18, much to my father's dismay – didn’t talk to me for like three months or whatever. I went straight into a sales role. By the time I was 21, I was managing people twice my age in that environment.
I'm quite a confident, sometimes a little cocky, individual when it comes to my level of expertise and knowing that I can help people achieve whatever kind of goals or focuses they've got in place for their brands, their businesses, their growth, that kind of thing, because I've done it myself over and over and over again. And to this day, I still own and operate several different businesses which collectively have almost 500 employees working for me, and a multi seven-figure annual revenue.
This stuff that I do in and around Youpreneur and online, it's not my biggest moneymaker, but it's my biggest passion. It is genuinely what I want to do for the next 10 plus years. There's no doubt in my mind about that. And it's because of the steps that I've taken with my other businesses that allow me to focus on this, it’s the very reason why I do it every single day.
But I think that when people put targets in place and they say, “Oh, I'm going to be doing, whatever, six figures by this time next year or seven figures by this time next year,” and then they don't take the actions needed, how can they expect to achieve it? You’ve only got yourself to blame.
Brian Clark: Well, let's talk about that a bit, because the running joke I see in our industry now is, “I learned it yesterday and I'm teaching it today.” I try to encourage people who know what they're talking about, much like you do with Youpreneur too, “You're a couple of steps ahead of the audience, that's okay, go ahead and start.” But it's gotten ridiculous. I mean, people who have done nothing, but they're working a side hustle and next thing you know, they're teaching you how to be an entrepreneur.
I think it's important. I think it's important for people to understand that you have real businesses that employ hundreds of people, many of whom I met and they kind of worship you. It's scary, because I know the real you, and come on.
Chris Ducker: I’m a good boss.
Brian Clark: No, you’re a great boss. Like when you took all of them to go see Star Wars. I mean, come on.
Chris Ducker: We took over the entire cinema. It was amazing at the IMAX.
Brian Clark: I know. That was so fantastic. And that's the kind of leader you are.
What Was Your Journey from Your Initial Job to Starting Your First Business?
Brian Clark: But let's talk a little bit. You go into a sales role right out of school. You didn't go to university, your dad's upset. If my son were to do that and he were to take a sales job, I'd say, “Okay, at least you're about to learn how it works.” Because that's a good education. Maybe you're not getting the classical education that parents kind of like to push their kids into, but that's the School of Hard Knocks. That's the School of Commerce.
So, briefly take us from that initial job, what happened, how did you start the businesses? And then we'll get our way up to Youpreneur, because I think it's important. I don't want to leave this out and for people to think, “Chris Ducker's some sweet talking English man with a sexy accent,” that I appreciate of course.
Chris Ducker: Well, thank you so much for that, Darling.
Brian Clark: This entire interview has so far gotten off on the wrong foot, I think. It’s okay.
Chris Ducker: But it’s okay. It’s what happens. It’s fine. We’ll just roll with it.
People still ask me today, “Who are you? What do you do?” And I just say the same thing, honestly, “I'm just a problem solver.” That's all I do. I just solve people's problems. If I do it effectively enough for the right people — that's the key right there — I am honored and blessed with the opportunity to put a price tag on those solutions.
In my early career, it would be getting great deals for people in classified or display advertising. Moving on, it would be exhibition stands and event space. Moving on further, it'd be the infomercial game. I was having meetings and doing business with Kevin Harrington long before Shark Tank came along. So this is how long I've been in the game.
Fast forward even further. One minute, I'm in Miami doing a voiceover for an infomercial, the next minute, I'm on the plane to Hong Kong to sign off and wrap up shoots of behind the scenes on movies in Hong Kong for DVD releases.
All these different things that I've done in my life have all led me to where I am today with the focus on building a personal brand business. Not just building a personal brand, because any bloody idiot with a Twitter account and a YouTube channel can do that.
What I'm talking about here is building a genuine business model that is highly profitable and ultimately future-proof, because you build the business of you, which is 100% original, because you're dead center. You're right there in the middle of it all. It can't be copied, there are no real competitors out there, regardless of what niche or industry you're in, and it becomes a future-proof business model. Because it'll carry on regardless of who's the president, or what referendum’s being filed in parliament, or what recession hits, or what housing market crashes. It doesn't matter.
If you are 100% in control of it, then you’re ultimately future-proofing your business, because people will, at the very end of the day, gravitate towards you for what you do best. You become somebody's favorite, whatever it is: favorite author, speaker, podcaster, whatever. And as your varying changes and focuses on interests kind of shapes and molds over the years, they will follow you.
Just like they have with you, Brian. Just like they have with you. Your hardcore fans have been with you for years and years and years. You've done a whole lot of stuff in the last five, six, seven years. And they've stayed with you because they love you. You’re their favorite. That's what we want to do. We want to become somebody's favorite.
Brian Clark: Okay. You started and then almost ended with two bookends that I think are the key here. You said, “The right people,” which is an aspect of marketing that I've always tried to key on and I almost get to the point where it's 50% of the game, “The right people and stop trying to market to everyone.” And then you, whatever that aspect is, trying to be unique in a world of undifferentiated products and services. Anything can be copied. Anything can be replicated, reverse engineered, but not you. This is what you keyed in on.
When Did Your Insight About the Power of The Personal Brand Begin?
Brian Clark: I find it interesting because even with the book Virtual Freedom and putting yourself out there as the authority on building this type of virtual organization and then of course, supplying the very capable people to help entrepreneurs and freelancers and whomever accomplish that, it wasn't really a Chris Ducker focused business until it became that way.
That's kind of interesting. Did the insight begin then, or did it evolve gradually?
Chris Ducker: Well, actually, it began for me, in terms of the power of the personal brand, it began even before Virtual Freedom. We're talking probably mid-2012, where I'd already been blogging and podcasting for a couple of years. Obviously, I had already been an entrepreneur for a good almost 10 years at that point.
I realized that everyone that read a blog and commented or listened to the show and retweeted it or did business — I mean, like people would always do business with me first way before any of my companies or my online platforms. It was always me. The first podcast was called “Virtual Business Lifestyle Show,” yet nobody called it that. Everyone just said, “Chris Ducker's podcast.”
It was about the middle of 2012, I had back surgery and I was laid up for a little bit recovering. And I really started to dive deep into what I was doing with my online properties. Was it something I wanted to continue, was it working for me, did I get enjoyment or a buzz out of it? And all those things came out positive to a certain degree. But I also realized that people just wanted more of me, and I wasn't actually giving it to them.
It sounds a little narcissistic, but I mean, like genuinely people wanted more of me. They wanted more of me on video or two episodes of the show every week instead of one, or more live events. They were asking for it. They were showing me that they wanted it.
I think that a lot of content creators nowadays don't pay attention to their audiences the way they should. You've got to listen to your audience, pay attention to your community, because ultimately they will decide what your business becomes in the future if you listen to them properly.
So that's what I started doing. It became very evident to me, as early as 2012, that I was seen as the VA guy. I was the authority on outsourcing on the Internet. So the book was inevitable at that point, I think.
I'm still seen as the VA guy. I don't get as many requests to do interviews on VAs as I used to. I'm not quoted as much as I used to, but the book's got 800 plus five-star reviews on Amazon. It’s sold well over 50,000 copies, and clearly from my royalty checks that come in every six months, I'm doing just fine in regards to what that message of the book is all about.
And you fast-forward…
Charisma and Marketing Like a Magnet
Brian Clark: Hold on, let's address…I know there's an obvious elephant in the room right now and all jokes aside, you have an incredibly dynamic personality, okay? You can't deny that. Not everyone does. I think that a lot of people say, “Well, sure Chris Ducker. Lesser extent, Brian Clark.” I like to express myself through writing more than otherwise, but still, I'm not shy for sure.
What do you say to the people who perhaps are intimidated by your level of charisma, if you will, and say, “That's not me.” I mean, I know my answer to that. But I think it's important for you, because you're the one preaching Youpreneur and this is key.
Chris Ducker: Well, I think that at the very core of the message of what it means to be a Youpreneur, I mean, a Youpreneur is somebody that ultimately builds a business based around them, their personality, their experience, their expertise, and obviously, the people they want to serve. If you do not want to be front and center of your business, then this is probably not the business model for you.
But I would also try and convince you to a certain degree that this is the way that almost every SME business is going to be set up and run in the future. It’s already happening right now.
Brian Clark: That's right.
Chris Ducker: Even huge brands, look at Virgin, Richard Branson. Would Virgin be what Virgin is without Richard Branson? Of course not, right?
Brian Clark: Yeah, and the shift is continuing to businesses of all levels.
Let me give you an example, fellow Englishman, Chris Garrett, who works for us, but also has his own site — Maker Hacks, 3D printing, all sorts of geeky cool stuff that Chris knows more about than anyone I know. And Chris is almost maddeningly kind of shy and reticent, and yet Chris puts himself out there and talks to his people. Remember? Point number one? And to those people, Chris is perfect.
It's not about being Mr. Shark Tank. I think this is the 20th century idea of what a media personality is. A media personality in the 21st century is who relates to their audience. That's it. There are no other parameters.
Chris Ducker: I call it, “Marketing like a magnet,” where you attract the best and repel the rest.
Brian Clark: Absolutely, yes.
Chris Ducker: That's a tweetable, kids, right there.
I truly believe that that is the way to build a long-term profitable future-proof business: market like a magnet. You attract the people that get you, your vibe, your message, understand how you can help them directly solve problems that they are experiencing both now and maybe in the future.
But at the exact same time, you are repelling away the people that are going to buy the $99 product, wait out to day 29 of the 30-day guarantee period and ask that $99 back, and then still bad mouth you on social. Or the people that they’re just naysayers.
They're not going to get it. No matter how much free content you give them, no matter how much you help them, no matter how many questions you reply to on Twitter or Instagram, they're never going to put their hand in their pocket and support you in any way. They're never going to actually take action on the advice that you give them. We don't need that kind of negativity in our lives. We need the people that get us.
So I'm a big believer of that. You market like a magnet, and you ultimately become somebody's favorite as a direct result of that, like I said earlier. And then, everything becomes easier. When you're surrounding yourself with people that get you, what you stand for and they know how you are going to help them, everything becomes easier, everything.
Brian Clark: Yeah, it's value and connection and being a human being. I don't use the word “authenticity” because it's so misunderstood whenever used.
Chris Ducker: Like “hustle.”
Brian Clark: Does the audience find you authentic? Then you are. I mean, that's what it is. It's not about sharing what you had for lunch.
What Are Some of the Key Messages of the Book?
Brian Clark: Okay, let's drill down a bit because up until this point, we haven't really drilled down into some key messages of the book, although I guess we probably have.
Chris Ducker: Oh, yes, definitely.
Brian Clark: Give us an overview.
Chris Ducker: Okay. The book itself came about mainly from feedback from within the Youpreneur community. We launched late 2015, as you know, and then in 2016, we kind of did a version two relaunch. With that, we identified and filled up a whole bunch of gaps in our training content that people had said, “Oh, this is great, but I need this,” or, “I need you to elaborate on this particular strategy.” So we filled up all these gaps.
Then when we were sitting down, figuring out how we were going to actually deliver this content, we came up with what is now known as the Youpreneur Roadmap, which is basically broken up into three sections of building, marketing and monetizing your personal brand business.
That's exactly how the book is set out as well. It's based off of the Youpreneur Roadmap. So there are three sections: building, marketing, monetizing — 14, 15 chapters all in all. It starts off with everything from defining who you are and defining your perfect customer, building your online home, that kind of stuff, all the way through to spreading a message, positioning yourself as an expert in your industry, and then obviously developing what we call the Youpreneur ecosystem and developing pricing for that and launching and all that sort of fun stuff as well.
It really is, I mean, we call it, “The definitive guide,” because it is the definitive guide. It takes you on that journey step by step. But equally, if you're already in the process of building your brand and you've already done most of the building part of it, skip the first 80 pages, go straight to marketing. You're not going to learn anything. For complete beginners, you read it cover to cover. For those that maybe are a step ahead of things, they can go ahead and just skip certain sections and go to the part that they really need.
Brian Clark: That sounds actually like a useful book, again, like Virtual Freedom.
The way you started was what got my light bulb or my recognition of wisdom. You didn't sit in a room in London or Singapore or wherever you may be at the moment, and come up with some sort of book idea. I mean, you spent time with real people struggling to become what they aspire to become. In line, they're your people. So therefore, they want to become Youpreneurs. And you took everything that you knew up to that point and you did your best and you said, “Here is what I'm going to teach you and here we're going to go.”
How Much Did You Learn from Your Audience?
Brian Clark: How much did you learn from actually interacting with those people? Because it's the most amazing thing. Whether it's writing Copyblogger, creating our initial course, I've learned things that I would have never gotten in a million years from the interaction and the enlightenment of just dealing with people who have real problems. And when you don't have a client-based business, like I don't and you don't anymore, at least not hands-on. That's amazing, that's gold. That's where the roadmap came from.
Chris Ducker: Absolutely. Yeah, and to answer your question directly, I learned more about the people that I want to serve over the next decade and help from that initial kind of feedback and exploratory season that we had in 2016 than I ever thought I would do, quite frankly, like deep stuff as well. Like legacy, the kind of topics and subjects that really, truly drive Youpreneurs, rather than just focus on building the business, but where do they want to be? What do they want to do? What change do they want to bring to the people they work with? What mark did they want to leave on the world?
That was the stuff. That was copywriting gold right there. Because what I did is I just forced my hand right the way down through their throat into their gut and pulled out the very focus of what they're all about and what they wanted to achieve. It became very easy at that point — in fact, actually, the subtitle of the book came directly from feedback that we got inside of the forums, “The Definitive Guide to Becoming,” and I quote, “The Go-To Leader in Your Industry.” That was the first thing that we saw coming up over and over and over again.
They wanted to be the source in their market, in their industry. When everybody said, “Hey, we need a speaker on how to use social media, who do we call?” That's the person that's the go-to source there. “Hey, we need someone who knows all about packaging online products. Who do we call?” “You call that guy. He's the guy in that market.” So that was the first thing, that go-to leader.
Then the second thing was building a future-proof business. Nobody wanted to start over again. I think a lot of that has obviously got to do with the fact that my perspective market or avatar for me is early 30’s in the upwards. They've already had a career of 10 plus years or so, and they don't want to start over again. They're not interested in doing that. For me, those two very big defining points that we got from that initial kind of exploratory season, like I said, was huge for the development of what ended up being the book.
But it wasn't the book at first, it was actually about the roadmap. It was actually about filling the gaps in that roadmap, which we did and we continue to do. Every month actually, it’s updated with new content. Sometimes we take stuff out, sometimes we put stuff in.
But ultimately, yeah, I didn't start this whole thing with the idea of, “Okay, it's been four years, time to go through hell again. Let's write another book.” No, that wasn't the case at all. It kind of just happened.
Here's the other thing, Brian, it didn't feel like I was under the pressure to write the book like it was with Virtual Freedom.
So, I must say also, I've independently published Rise of the Youpreneur, although when you get the book, you might not think it, because it's unlike any other self-published book I’ve ever held in my hands in terms of the look and the feel and the quality. I've had like big authors who have gotten a copy of the book from when we gave it out in London at the summit last year. They go, “Wait a minute. Wow. This is self-published? Who the hell did you use?”
I've spent the time and the energy and the effort and the money, quite frankly, to put it together in a way that you wouldn't necessarily think that it's self-published. But the fact that it was self-published meant that there was no pressure. I could get it out whenever I wanted to get it out. If it flowed nicely, it would come out sooner rather than later. There was no real pressure.
But we noticed pretty early on, me and my team as we were putting the content together for it, that it was all there. I mean, man, it was all there. It’s just a matter…
Brian Clark: It’s almost like it was a matter of taking what you know over a long period of time and yet, channeling — what's the right word here? You were channeling the problems and desires in a more perfect way because of actually basing the book on interaction and not theory.
Chris Ducker: Yeah, that sums it up perfectly. That's exactly what happened. And it just so happens that the finalization of it from a manuscript perspective into design, into cover design and whatnot, it just so happened that it coincided with the first Youpreneur Summit coming up in November. And let me tell you, it was right down to the wire.
We wanted to get a copy to everybody that was at the event. When we realized that we could potentially do it, we really wanted to do it. So we pushed buttons and did what we needed to do to make it happen, but it was right down to the wire. I mean, we literally received the books the evening before the first day of the conference. At one point I didn't think it was going to happen, but it all worked out.
Brian Clark: Self-imposed pressure is always the best, right?
Chris Ducker: Not a bad thing, not a bad thing. As if putting on an event isn't stressful enough as it is, “Let's get a book out the same time, why not?”
Brian Clark: Of course, because the event’s easy.
What’s the Number One Point in the Marketing Phase for People to Take Away from This?
Brian Clark: All right, the Unemployable audience is not exactly beginner level. They're generally running their own businesses at some level, but they're always looking for more in the terms of more clients, more product sales, next level. In the Youpreneur model, in the marketing phase of the roadmap, what's your number one? What's your key point you want everyone to take away from this?
Chris Ducker: I think that actually showing more of the behind the scenes of your business is something that can drive all of those things, and we go into that obviously in the book. We're in a position today that we've never been in before from a marketing perspective where we can do that very, very easily. You can do it with very on-the-hop video with Instagram stories or Instagram Live or Snapchat. You can do it maybe in a slightly more controlled environment with something like Facebook Live.
Just show the behind the scenes of your business. Show the behind the scenes of the development of the next product, or how you're building out the packaging for it, or how you're developing the new membership community.
When we launched Youpreneur, we did it exclusively on Periscope. We had over 200 people join in the first few days, because they were so bought in to everything they had seen and heard about the community for about six or seven weeks before we actually opened the door. They were waiting to give me their money, because they saw everything behind the scenes. I mean, I showed them everything from behind the scenes. They just couldn't wait to get involved.
I think it builds this kind of — what do they call them? These brand ambassadors or these sort of sexy names or whatever, whatever. You're just getting people excited. You're just showing them the behind the scenes, the guts of your business. And I think we need to do more and more and more of that. I think that history has kind of made us believe that until it's ready to go, you shouldn't show it to anyone. I completely disagree with that.
I remember doing some short Instagram story videos of the front cover of Youpreneur, which actually originally had a graphic cover. It didn't have the photo of me. And everyone was like, “Yeah, it's okay, but it doesn't really grab my attention.” It was actually comments that we had from those Instagram stories from people saying, “Why are you not on the cover? You're the Youpreneur. You coined the phrase. Why are you not out there being the ambassador to all of us?” And that's why I ended up on the cover, quite frankly.
So I think that showing the behind the scenes of what you're doing, how you're doing it, why you're doing it and who you're doing it for is an extremely powerful marketing tactic nowadays.
Brian Clark: I love it. Austin Kleon calls that “showing your work,” and he’s speaking generally to artists or aspiring artists. What is that but an entrepreneur as well? I even had a conversation with him that equated his ideas of creativity and marketing for artists to the entrepreneur. Because if you're doing it right, it's not all that different. I think that's a worthwhile understanding. It's not about being a car salesman even though we are all salespeople.
Chris Ducker: Everyone’s selling something.
Brian Clark: Yeah, and the sooner you accept that, the more you'll get on with getting it done.
Chris Ducker: Absolutely.
Brian Clark: Chris, I'm looking forward to the book. It's actually, as of the publication date of this episode, out now. I would suggest picking one up. Chris does not write a book every year on the treadmill. You actually have to give him the cattle prod. I respect it though. I mean, you write a book when you're like, “Okay, it's time to write a book.”
Chris Ducker: Right, and clearly this will be…
Brian Clark: To actually share something like Virtual Freedom was like, “Okay, I’ve got to tell people how to do this, because there's clearly a market of people who are interested.” It’s the same thing with this. Personal branding — God, it's almost become a joke, right? But you, early on in this conversation, said, “It's not personal branding. It's a personal brand business.” There's a difference there. It's not some yahoo on Instagram or Twitter.
Chris Ducker: No, it's not. It's a real business. A lot of money to be made and a lot of changes to make to a lot of lives if you do it the right way.
Where Can We Get the Book and Find Out More About the Youpreneur Community?
Brian Clark: All right, we're going to put all this in the show notes, but Chris, tell us where we can get the book. Where we can find out more about Youpreneur, specifically the community?
Chris Ducker: Well, obviously, you can get the book on Amazon. That's going to be a top spot right there. Just search for Youpreneur. Or if you want to go to the Riseoftheyoupreneur.com, which is the full title of the book. If you order via that and then give me your receipt, I'll give you lots of bonuses. And Youpreneur.com is where all the community fun and games happen.
Brian Clark: Chris, thanks a lot, man. It's been great catching up and the fact that we recorded it is even better.
Chris Ducker: These are the conversations that we have even when we're not recording. And I think we should just record them every time we actually talk.
Brian Clark: That's what everyone says, but there would be a lot more cursing, and a lot of stories that would be bad. And I already told the story about being in a shallow water receptacle with you. So, I mean, I think we'll keep it to this.
Chris Ducker: Yeah, that's a good idea.
Brian Clark: Rise of the Youpreneur people. It's worth your time, it's worth your money. It's probably not all that expensive relative to most things.
I’ve got to say, I also am highly familiar with Chris' community – it’s education, it’s support, it’s mentorship, not just from Chris, but really from the whole group. And that's in my book, that's a real online community. It's not about the cult of personality as strong as Ducker's is, but those people take care of each other. I've seen it and I think that's what a lot of people are looking for these days.
Anyway, check out the book and thanks for listening. And as always, keep going.